TOP secret Service Spymaster interview 911
Arnaud de Borchgrave, United Press International
editor-at-large, interviews Pakistan ISI Chief
General Hamid Gul
"The attacks against the twin towers started at
8:45 a.m. and four flights are diverted from their
assigned air space and no air traffic controller
sounds the alarm. And no Air Force jets scramble
until 10 a.m. That also smacks of a small scale Air
Force rebellion, a coup against the Pentagon
perhaps? Radars are jammed, transponders fail. No
IFF -- friend or foe identification -- challenge.
In Pakistan, if there is no response to IFF, jets
are instantly scrambled and the aircraft is shot
down with no further questions asked. This was
clearly an inside job. Bush was afraid and rushed
to the shelter of a nuclear bunker. He clearly
feared a nuclear situation. Who could that have
been? Will that also be hushed up in the
investigation, like the Warren report after the
Kennedy assassination?"
De Borchgrave: So who did Black Sept. 11?
Gul: Mossad and its accomplices. The U.S. spends
$40 billion a year on its 11 intelligence agencies.
That's $400 billion in 10 years. Yet the Bush
Administration says it was taken by surprise. I
don't believe it. Within 10 minutes of the second
twin tower being hit in the World Trade Center CNN
said Osama bin Laden had done it. That was a
planned piece of disinformation by the real
perpetrators. It created an instant mindset and put
public opinion into a trance, which prevented even
intelligent people from thinking for themselves.
Q: So you're already convinced bin Laden didn't do
it?
A: I know bin Laden and his associates. I've been
with them here, in Europe and the Middle East. They
are graduates of the best universities and are
highly intelligent with impressive degrees and
speak impeccable English. These are people who have
rediscovered fundamental Islamic values. Many come
from the Gulf countries where ruling royal families
have generated hatred by the way they flout divine
law, wasting billions on gratifying their whims,
jetting around in large private jets by themselves,
and sailing the Mediterranean in big private boats
for weeks on end. Osama's best recruits come from
feudal areas that are U.S. protectorates and where
millions of poor people are seeking human dignity.
I have even visited a Christian convent school in
Murree, 60 miles from here, where my 13-year-old
daughter is studying. The young girls there have
told me Osama is their hero. Osama's followers
identify with Mujahideen freedom fighters wherever
they are defending Islam and its values.
Q: So what makes you think Osama wasn't behind
Sept. 11?
A: From a cave inside a mountain or a peasant's
hovel? Let's be serious. Osama inspires countless
millions by standing up for Islam against American
and Israeli imperialism. He doesn't have the means
for such a sophisticated operation.
Q: Why Mossad?
A: Mossad and its American associates are the
obvious culprits. Who benefits from the crime? The
attacks against the twin towers started at 8:45
a.m. and four flights are diverted from their
assigned air space and no air traffic controller
sounds the alarm. And no Air Force jets scramble
until 10 a.m. That also smacks of a small scale Air
Force rebellion, a coup against the Pentagon
perhaps? Radars are jammed, transponders fail. No
IFF -- friend or foe identification -- challenge.
In Pakistan, if there is no response to IFF, jets
are instantly scrambled and the aircraft is shot
down with no further questions asked. This was
clearly an inside job. Bush was afraid and rushed
to the shelter of a nuclear bunker. He clearly
feared a nuclear situation. Who could that have
been? Will that also be hushed up in the
investigation, like the Warren report after the
Kennedy assassination?
Q: At this point, someone might be asking what
you've been smoking. What is Israel's interest in
such a monstrous plot, which, of course, no one
believes except Islamist extremists who concocted
this piece of disinformation in the first place,
presumably to detract from the real culprits?
A: Jews never agreed to Bush 41 (George H.W. Bush,
the 41st president) or 43 (his son George W. Bush,
the 43rd president). They made sure Bush senior
didn't get a second term. His land-for-peace
pressure in Palestine didn't suit Israel. They were
also against the young Bush because he was
considered too close to oil interests and the Gulf
countries. Bush senior and Jim Baker had raised
$150 million for Bush junior, much of it from
Mideast sources or their American go-betweens. Bush
41 and Baker, as private citizens, had also
facilitated the new strategic relationship between
Saudi Arabia and Iran. I have this from sources in
both countries. So clearly the prospect of a Bush
43 was a potential danger to Israel.
Jews were stunned by the way Bush stole the
election in Florida. They had put big money on Al
Gore. Israel has given its imperialist guardian
parent opportunities to turn disaster into a
pretext for imposing an all-encompassing military,
political and economic agenda to further the cause
of global capitalism. While Colin Powell is
cautious and others are reckless and want to make
up for their failure to defeat Saddam Hussein in
the Gulf War 10 years ago, the global agenda is the
same.
Israel knows it has a short shelf-life before it is
overwhelmed by demographics. It is a state that was
born in terrorism that terrorized Palestinians into
the exile of refugee camps, where they have now
subsisted in squalid refugee camps, and is now very
much afraid of Pakistan's nuclear capability.
Israel has now handed the Bush family the
opportunity it has been waiting for to consolidate
America's imperial grip on the Gulf and acquire
control of the Caspian basin by extending its
military presence in Central Asia. Bush
conveniently overlooks -- or is not told -- the
fact that Islamic fundamentalists got their big
boost in the modern age as CIA assets in the covert
campaign I was also involved with to force the
Soviets out of Afghanistan. Bush senior was vice
president during that entire campaign. And no
sooner did he become president on Jan. 20, 1989,
than he summoned an inter-agency intelligence
meeting and issued an order, among several others,
to clip the wings of ISI (Pakistani Inter-Services
Intelligence) that had been coordinating the entire
operation in Afghanistan. I know this firsthand as
I was DGISI at the time (director general, ISI).
Q: So how do you read U.S. strategy in Pakistan?
A: The destabilization of Pakistan is part of the
U.S. plan because it is a Muslim nuclear state. The
U.S. wants to isolate Pakistan from China as part
of its containment policy. President Nixon's book
"The Real War" said China would be the superpower
of the 21st Century. The U.S. is also creating
hostility between Pakistan and Afghanistan, two
Muslim states to reverse the perception that the
Islamic world now has its own nuclear weapons. Bush
43 doesn't realize he is being manipulated by
people who understand geopolitics. He is not
leading but being led. All he can do is think in
terms of the wanted-dead-or-alive culture, which is
how Hollywood conditions the masses to think and
act.
All summer long we heard about America's shrinking
surplus and that the Pentagon would not have
sufficient funds to modernize for the 21st century.
And now, all of a sudden, the Pentagon can get what
it wants without any Democratic Party opposition.
How very convenient! Even your cherished civil
liberties can now be abridged with impunity to
protect the expansion of the hegemony of
transnational capitalism. There is now a new excuse
to crush anti-globalization protests.
Bush 43 follows Bush 41. Iraq was baited into the
Kuwaiti trap when the U.S. told Saddam it was not
interested in his inter-Arab squabbles. Two days
later, he moved into Kuwait, which was an Iraqi
province anyway before the British Empire decreed
otherwise. Roosevelt baited the Pearl Harbor trap
for the Japanese empire, which provided the pretext
for entering World War II.
And now the Israelis have given the U.S. the
pretext for further expansion into an area that
will be critical in the next 25 years - the Caspian
basin.
Q: Were you a fundamentalist in the days of the war
against the Soviets in Afghanistan when you worked
closely with the CIA?
A: Not as much as I am today.
Q: What turned you against America?
A: Betrayals and broken promises and what was done
to my army career.
Q: And what was that?
A: President Ishaq Khan, who succeeded Zia ul-Haq
after his plane was blown out of the sky, wanted to
appoint me chief of staff, the highest position in
the Pakistani army. The U.S., which by then had
clipped ISI's wings, also blocked my promotion by
informing the president I was unacceptable. So I
was moved to a corps commander position. As ISI
director, I held the whole Mujahideen movement in
the palm of my hands. We were all pro-American. But
then America left us in the lurch and everything
went to pieces, including Afghanistan.
The U.S. pushed for a broad-based Afghan government
of seven factions and then waved goodbye. Even in
the best of democracies, a broad-based coalition
does not work. So we quickly had seven jokers in
Kabul interested in only one thing - jockeying for
power. The gunplay quickly followed, which led to
the creation of Taliban, the students of the
original Mujahideen, who decided to put an end to
it.
Q: What happened to the 1,000 shoulder-fired
Stinger anti-aircraft missiles that were supplied
by president Reagan in 1986 and 87 to the
Mujahideen, and that literally grounded the Soviet
air force?
A: After the Soviets pulled out, the CIA allocated
$60 million to try to buy them back. This just
drove the black market price up for one Stinger
from $100,000 to $300,000. The Taliban still have
about 250 of them for the kind of situation they
face today against U.S. aircraft.
Q: Is the U.S. now your enemy?
A: Is the U.S. national interest in contradiction
with the Muslim world? The U.S. needs oil, as do
its European allies. You have between 6 and 8
million American Muslims and their ranks are
growing. About the same number in Europe. Israel
aside, we are America's natural allies. Prof. Sam
Huntington in his "Clash of Civilizations" puts
Confucius and Judeo-Christians in one corner, and
us in the other. His prescription is wrong but is
being adopted by Bush 43 who has now put 60
countries on his hit list. This is the diabolical
school that wants to launch an anti-Muslim
"crusade." Muslims understood what Bush meant when
he used that word.
We need a meeting, not a clash, of civilizations.
We are on the brink of disaster. It is time to pull
back from the brink and reassess before we blow
ourselves up. The purpose of Islam is service to
humanity. The time for like-minded people to have a
meeting of the minds is now.
Q: But you are against democracy, so how can there
be a meeting of the minds?
A: Democracy does not work. Politicians are
constantly thinking of their next election, not the
public good, which means, at best, constantly
shading the truth to hide it from their
constituents. Their pronouncements are laced with
lies and the voters are lulled or gulled into
believing utter nonsense. The Koran says call a
spade a spade. It is the supreme law and tells
right from wrong. There is no notion of "my country
right or wrong" under divine law. The creator's
will predominates. All if subservient to Allah's
will and adherence to a set of basic, fundamental
values.
Q: So what kind of a system are you advocating?
A: The world needs a post-modern state system.
Right now, the nation-state and round the clock
satellite TV lead people to imitate America's way
of life. Which is mathematically impossible. You
have 4 percent of the world's population consuming
32 percent of the world's resources. The creator
through Prophet Mohammed said equal distribution.
Capitalism is the negation of the creator's will.
It leads to imperialism and unilateralism.
Q: So what does this post-modern state system look
like?
A: A global village under divine order, or we will
have global bloodshed until good triumphs over
evil. Islam encapsulates all the principal
religions and what was handed down 1,400 years ago
was the normal evolutionary sequel to Judaism and
Christianity. The prophet's last sermon was a
universal document of human rights for everyone
that surpasses everything that came since,
including America's declaration of independence and
the U.N. Charter of universal rights. If you
superimpose true secular values on true Islamic
values, there is no difference. So surely divine
law should supersede man-made law. Islam is
egalitarian, tolerant and progressive. It is the
wave of the future.
Q: Marxism also believed that the nation-state
would eventually wither away.
A: Socialism jumped the rails when it was co-opted
by the imperialist Soviet state. Islam believes in
dynamism, Christianity stands for static statism.
The pope in all his pronouncements has expressed a
dogmatic attachment to the status quo. Why are so
many black Americans converting to Islam? Because
they are looking for true equality which they
cannot find under capitalism. Allah has no gender,
neither male nor female. Islam has no indirect
taxation in an interest-free economy. Usury was a
Jewish concept.
Q: Is Iran your model?
A: There isn't a single true Islamic state in the
world today. Iran has moved forward from its 1979
revolution, but I am not sure whether it's the
right direction.
Q: And Taliban?
A: They represent Islam in its purest form so far.
It's a clean sheet. And they were also moving in
the right direction when this crisis was cooked up
by the U.S. Until Sept. 11, they had perfect law
and order with no formal police force, only traffic
cops without sidearms. Now, in less than two weeks,
they have mobilized some 300,000 volunteers to
fight American and British invaders if they come.
Q: And your reaction to U.S. demands on Pakistan?
A: If Pakistan gives the U.S. base rights we will
have a national upheaval. And if the U.S. attacks
Afghanistan, there will be a call -- a fatwa -- for
a general jihad. All borders will then disappear
and it will be a no-holds-barred Islamic uprising
against Israel and American imperialism. Pakistan
will be engulfed in the firestorm. So I can only
hope that cooler heads will prevail in Washington.
Q: What about the other U.S. demands?
A: Overflight rights are meaningless since the U.S.
violates air space daily all over the world. As for
intelligence sharing with ISI, you can't even catch
your own terrorists. And what ISI gives you will be
of marginal value anyway.
Q: President (Pervez) Musharraf has made strong
statements supporting the U.S.
A: He was my student in the army. He is a good man,
but he doesn't understand Islam. The army will
never fight the masses. If push comes to shove,
Musharraf will say no to the Americans rather than
turn against the people. He is not just facing a
handful of angry people. By his own admission, it's
10 percent to 15 percent of the population, or at
least 10 million people willing to fight. For
openers, they would close the port of Karachi. A
country cannot breathe without lungs.
Q: Back to Osama's terrorist network. Who was
behind the bombing of the U.S. Embassies in
Tanzania and Kenya?
A: Mossad is strong in both countries. Remember the
Israeli operation to free hostages in Entebbe
(Uganda)? Both Kenya and Tanzania were part of the
logistical tail. A so-called associate of Osama was
framed at Karachi airport. The incidents took place
on Aug. 8, 1999, and on the 10th a short,
clean-shaven man disembarks at Karachi airport and
presents the passport of a bearded man. Not your
passport, he was told. He then tries to bribe the
clerk with 200 rupees. A ludicrously small sum
given the circumstances. The clerk says no and
turns him in and he starts singing right away. Not
plausible. Osama has sworn to me on the Koran it
was not him and he is truthful to a fault. Pious
Muslims do not kill innocent civilians who included
many Muslim victims. The passport must have been
switched while the man was asleep on the plane in
what has all the earmarks of a Mossad operation.
For 10 years, the Mujahideen fought the Soviets in
Afghanistan and not a single Soviet embassy was
touched anywhere in the world. So this could not
have been Osama's followers.
Q: What if bin Laden has been lying to you and is
guilty. Is that inconceivable?
A: If Taliban are given irrefutable evidence of his
guilt, I am in favor of a fair trial. In America,
one is entitled to a jury of peers. But he has no
American peers. The Taliban would not object, in
the event of a prima face case, to an international
Islamic court meeting in The Hague. They would turn
extradite Osama to the Netherlands.
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